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[知乎讨论]如何看待“凤姐”被新浪微博禁言这一现象?

[注:以下内容采集自知乎。]

事件起因:

http://ent.ifeng.com/idolnews/mainland/detail_2011_08/01/8081852_0.shtml(凤凰网)有关“禁言”:http://weibo.com/1648320064/xgJEOetaz(@薛陈子:据观察,新浪微博已经删除了@罗玉凤 利用温州动车事故炒作的帖子,而@罗玉凤 的微博很可能已经被禁言。赞新浪此举!)

===================================

magasa

————–

新浪迫于民愤采取了措施,严格意义上当然是对言论自由的侵害。不过国内就是这样,民愤经常大于公正。

 

凤姐关于动车死难者的言论,在正常人看来,毫无疑问是缺乏同情心、令人无比厌恶的,也许有炒作动机。但缺乏同情心、令人厌恶、有炒作动机的言论也有权利存在,这至多是个道德问题。对其强制性封杀,我觉得是用道德标准取代了法律标准(新浪的管理制度在这里可以视为一种“法”,而且其用户协议恐怕并没有对这类行为的约束)。

 

以下是根据评论内容作的一点补充:

今天有人把凤姐说的话比作纳粹言论封杀,明天就有人把你说过的任何话比作纳粹再封杀。

对你讨厌的任何言论,你都可以用“言论自由不是绝对的”这样的片汤儿话将其划分到应该保护的言论范围之外,结果剩下的可以说出的言论就所剩无几了。

既然这么多人认为凤姐的言论超出了通常的言论自由边界,也没见人从学理上来论证一下为何超出了,界限到底在哪里。中国没有言论自由的实施传统,也可以比照西方国家的实践来讨论。

至于另一种观点——新浪有权封杀自己平台上的任何观点,新浪是一个企业私有的平台——我建议还是用网友注册时的用户协议说话。

 

吕驰宇 ,一个社会救济金领取者

———————————

首先不确定是不是新浪已经强制禁言,但她确实删除了那三条微博,而且27号以来没有再发表任何言论。

 

基于以上事实,很多人说言论自由要保护不能删帖删账户,但却选择用一个错误的理由:别人没有权力去剥夺她言论的自由。我要说虽然新浪没有权力去限制她,但却有权利。

 

新浪是一个经济组织,它的微博业务是在用户注册时即有权利义务条款的,用户不去读不代表你不同意,如果你不同意,你可以选择不注册,可以去其它微博做自己的平台,不涉及强制的公权力问题,何况新浪微博是一个免费提供的虚拟服务。作为同类服务微博这种舆论平台的提供者,它不涉及垄断舆论平台的问题,新浪当然是可以出于它身经济利益考量而去删除不利于自己商业发展的微博,乃至账户,这是在用户注册条款里写明了的。

 

因此删帖删账户本质上是中立的,但是要看谁去做,做这件事的主体有没有受到制约,如果是因可能滥施暴力但却受到人民制约的公权力,你就要对人民作出解释;但若不涉及公权力的民事行为主体,出于商业因素且未受公权力授意或影响的前提下,新浪甚至可以说我认为你违反了我的利益所以我不但删你贴而且不解释,毕竟这是一项免费,虚拟的服务,就是我发明了一样东西,但是不让你免费用了,你花钱求我我也不让你用。

 

作为行为主体,新浪做什么都不会是合法垄断暴力的国家之国家行为,因此它可以通过履行契约权利,而不是使用(公)权力,去做这件事。当然我们无权干涉,但个人认为长远来看新浪删除罗玉凤的账号从商业以及政治,道德等各个角度都将是一个对自己有利的选择。

 

当然我们也没有必要非得删除她的微博或账号,我们需要做的只是不去关注她这个人而已。她可以低俗,也可以鄙视高尚和向往高尚的人,也可以通过贩卖低俗,侮辱自己扮小丑来赚钱,但是我们有必要让她明白她用侮辱别人的方法是赚不到钱的,因为我们没有她那么贱。而证明我们比她智商高的唯一方法就是让她无法再用这种低级方法赚到我们一分钱。那样,我想她以后可能会求我们关注的。

 

野稻田

—————–

这件事因@麦田 同学的强烈抵制风声水起!

一、平等的自由。既然新浪可以随便封禁一个关于xx的账号,随便删几条关于XX的言论,那么对于凤姐这种严重触及道德底线的言论为什么不作任何处理(在麦田抗议之后才删几条微博)。

二、@麦田在履行承诺,删掉所有微博之后,留下了一条“遗言”,而这条遗言被转了1000多次后被禁止转载,何解?详见:http://weiwuhui.com/4360.html

三、据麦田:“罗玉凤”是新浪独家签约微博。在商业利益面前,新浪站在了社会的责任的对立面!

在政府面前,新浪屈膝,任谁都悲愤,去TMD言论自由;在商业利益面前,新浪昂首:我们要保护公民的言论自由,至于良心道德谁还管。

我说:去TMD伪言论自由!

 

郭磊 ,法律从业者,017号用户

———————————

在中国,民愤确实经常大于公正,观点的多元化理应比表达正确的观点更重要,新浪封杀罗玉凤的行为,可以体现出他们的管理尺度,以及对于自由表达观点的态度,我觉得,不能将一家商业性网站完全等同于公权力机关,更没有必要将删帖和封号,一律上升到侵犯言论自由的地步。

 

@magasa的部分观点我并不赞同,理由如下:

-新浪用户协议4.6.6规定:不得利用新浪提供的网络服务上传、展示或传播任何虚假的、骚扰性的、中伤他人的、辱骂性的、恐吓性的、庸俗淫秽的或其他任何非法的信息资料;此外,4.6.8也规定:不得利用新浪网络服务系统进行任何不利于新浪的行为;

既然罗玉凤的言论,“在正常人看来,毫无疑问是令人无比厌恶的”,新浪的处理方式可以自圆其说。

-我国的民事权利中没有“言论自由权”,如果罗玉凤认为新浪的处理手段侵权,应该以合同违约向法院起诉。

 

新浪基于商业因素考量,在大量用户的抗议下,采取有利其自身利益和声誉的行为,对罗玉凤的帐号进行锁定无可厚非,这并不是用道德标准来替代“法律标准”,因为人家协议中白纸黑字已经写的很清楚了。

 

新浪的商业操守、罗玉凤的秉性、我们这个国家对于言论自由的态度,大家都心知肚明,我觉得可以逐一进行批判,但如果硬要将三者拧巴在一起,难免有些小题大做了。

 

付鑫 ,Freedom

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截止到刚才为止,凤姐的粉丝仍然有120多万个,这样一个天天发布垃圾信息,通过丑化攻击别人来谋取关注的人,现在还能吸引这么多眼球,难道不是一件很荒唐的事么?像凤姐自己说的 “一个人因丑化而出名。因丑化而发家。因恶搞而失国。因嫉妒而离乡。不是 我一人悲哀。是社会悲哀”。凤姐的出名恰恰体现了我们社会里无处不在的歧视,而这些歧视很多都来自于那些和凤姐一样,收入并不高,社会地位也不高的人。

我个人认为,凤姐的言论仍然在言论自由的范畴,她的言论还没有越界,当然他可能触碰了我们传统道德中相当重要的一条“死者为大”,但网友们删贴的要求,过了。

 

sulikov ,基本宅男 绘画专业

——————————

(普通法系)法律保护人们说错话的权利,只要这个错话(包括煽动民众刺杀总统)不至于产生明显且即刻的危险;中国法律在这方面界限不是一般的模糊,因言获罪的情况不比历朝历代低。

新浪微博借民意限制公民言论自由是即违法律又反法律的行为:

违法律:新浪微博鉴于罗玉凤这种行为无执法权(如果老老实实遵从中国宪法的话;    当然了 法律不是挡箭牌,当年刘少奇不也是手拿宪法啥也没挡住嘛)

反法律:借用民意是民主行为,法律的行使过程恰恰是反民主行为(法律的制定过程是民主行为),所以借用民意行使法律的行为是反法律的行为

新浪微博在借用民意(行使民主)的过程中透明度也不高(投票的统计由谁监督)。

 

LO ,之乎者也

—————

1、为了争取言论自由权,不应禁言:凤对“7.23”事情的言论态度,只能代表他的言论,问题在于他怎么说,而是在于我们整个国家没有公民言论自由的权利,大部分的人迫于大局的压力不敢说,而凤姐敢于肆无忌惮的表达而已,我觉得没必要禁言,禁言反而让我们本来有没有多少言论自由的权利,丧失的彻底。

2、包容,让社会多样化:每个人都有说话的权利,1000个人就是1000个哈姆雷特,允许多种声音的存在,包容体现社会的多样化,如果“人人亦云”,这个社会就无可救药啦。这如同“7.23”、“矿难”、“强拆”等各类发生在我国的公共事件上,境内媒体都千篇一律报道“大而无为的救灾、英雄事迹”,将一次次本来需要哀悼检讨的会议,变成了“表彰大会”,这才导致我们社会的这样病态,“7.23”事件才会引起我跟人民对铁道部等政府部门的“痛之彻、恨之深”。

贠挺 ,专注WEB开发

每个人都有说话的权利,新浪不有很多微博都是呼吁要中国要有言论自由么?如果自己都分不清民主,就别奢求得到民主,怎么有人言论自由的时候就要禁言?新浪这是在犯贱。

罗玉凤本身就是在炒作,还有那么多傻逼去成为她的微博粉丝,去关注她的言论。得出结论:关注她的都是傻逼。

为什么有人呼吁要封杀他?那基本都是她的那些个傻逼粉丝在呼吁,因为其他人几乎很少关注她。新浪还要去听一帮傻逼的言论?

我曾经记得新浪CEO曹国伟原来就关注过罗玉凤,微博当时在推广的时候,也用过此事做过噱头,新浪当时也不就想利用罗玉凤言论来提高用户的活跃度么?从这个方面说新浪有点过河拆桥的意思,不地道。

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